Maureen Peltier - SSG Moe - Militia Tool

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Whip
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Re: Maureen Peltier - SSG Moe - Militia Tool

Post by Whip » Mon May 30, 2016 2:12 pm

spiduh wrote:They've already been told by the county police that it is considered littering. I'll give them a hint about what the DOT and OSP will say:
Hoffman hasn’t been able to get any real help from police or Oregon’s Department of Transportation. The problem is, pilfering roadside crosses isn’t illegal.

“There’s not much we can do,” said Mark Epps, the state’s transportation maintenance manager for Coos Bay and Coquille. “I’d be like going out and picking up anything off the road.”

In fact, Oregon State Police Sgt. John Keeler said the crosses themselves are technically illegal. As a sign of respect to the fallen victims, the police “don’t enforce that in any way, shape or form.”
http://theworldlink.com/roadside-memori ... 963f4.html

I know they are planning on calling the state AG on Tuesday, I'd be really surprised if they are told anything different. It's time to figure something else out. Preferably something that doesn't involve posting 24hr armed guards.
they can certainly erect memorials on their own personal properties (if they own them) should they feel so inclined. :mrgreen:

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Re: Maureen Peltier - SSG Moe - Militia Tool

Post by spiduh » Mon May 30, 2016 2:24 pm

phelana wrote:I saw where BJ Soper was hot on this topic again. Wasn't it just last month that he wrote a post saying they should stop putting up crosses and move on? I believe he called it a waste of time and there were other better things to do with their time.
Indeed. And they have some sort of private auction site somewhere hidden away from the trolls where they are currently trying to sell the last batch of crap they collected from the site to raise money.
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Re: Maureen Peltier - SSG Moe - Militia Tool

Post by spiduh » Mon May 30, 2016 2:27 pm

Somebody Lindsay Brewster Szymanski is livestreaming their Portland protest thingy.

Direct link:
“If they kill me, grab my phone.” –Ammon Bundy (Reuters)
"Yes, I Did Turn the Flying Monkeys Loose!" -Anna von Reitz (FB)
"I 'Self Identify' as a female" -Jon Ritzheimer (FB)

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Re: Maureen Peltier - SSG Moe - Militia Tool

Post by RVInit » Mon May 30, 2016 2:30 pm

Whip wrote:
spiduh wrote:They've already been told by the county police that it is considered littering. I'll give them a hint about what the DOT and OSP will say:
Hoffman hasn’t been able to get any real help from police or Oregon’s Department of Transportation. The problem is, pilfering roadside crosses isn’t illegal.

“There’s not much we can do,” said Mark Epps, the state’s transportation maintenance manager for Coos Bay and Coquille. “I’d be like going out and picking up anything off the road.”

In fact, Oregon State Police Sgt. John Keeler said the crosses themselves are technically illegal. As a sign of respect to the fallen victims, the police “don’t enforce that in any way, shape or form.”
http://theworldlink.com/roadside-memori ... 963f4.html

I know they are planning on calling the state AG on Tuesday, I'd be really surprised if they are told anything different. It's time to figure something else out. Preferably something that doesn't involve posting 24hr armed guards.
they can certainly erect memorials on their own personal properties (if they own them) should they feel so inclined. :mrgreen:
Oh, but that wouldn't be the same. Forcing their views (and monuments) on people who are aren't interested is part of their game.
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Re: Maureen Peltier - SSG Moe - Militia Tool

Post by RVInit » Mon May 30, 2016 2:34 pm

spiduh wrote:Somebody Lindsay Brewster Szymanski is livestreaming their protest thingy.

Direct link:

Looks like they are on a street where they are the only ones present. Haven't seen them pass a single person except the one that came intentionally to join them.
:lol:
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Re: Maureen Peltier - SSG Moe - Militia Tool

Post by spiduh » Mon May 30, 2016 2:37 pm

If you are going to misinterpret the Constitution, at least quote it right. It doesn't say 10 square miles, it say 10 miles square. That is 100 square miles. Dope.

There are an awful lot of overweight white folk in that bunch.
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Re: Maureen Peltier - SSG Moe - Militia Tool

Post by RVInit » Mon May 30, 2016 2:39 pm

spiduh wrote:
phelana wrote:I saw where BJ Soper was hot on this topic again. Wasn't it just last month that he wrote a post saying they should stop putting up crosses and move on? I believe he called it a waste of time and there were other better things to do with their time.
Indeed. And they have some sort of private auction site somewhere hidden away from the trolls where they are currently trying to sell the last batch of crap they collected from the site to raise money.
Their first couple of 'monuments' to LaVoy were completely tasteless - a collection of red, white, and blue items, and 40 flags of every size. It looked like the leftovers you might find on July 5th at the dollar store.
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Re: Maureen Peltier - SSG Moe - Militia Tool

Post by aiiPancho » Mon May 30, 2016 2:41 pm

spiduh wrote:If you are going to misinterpret the Constitution, at least quote it right. It doesn't say 10 square miles, it say 10 miles square. That is 100 square miles. Dope.

There are an awful lot of overweight white folk in that bunch.
...and FB says they can see who's watching the stream. A sad looking bunch, regardless.

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Re: Maureen Peltier - SSG Moe - Militia Tool

Post by Foggy » Mon May 30, 2016 2:44 pm

As a sign of respect to the fallen victims ...
Aye, there's the rub.

This particular memorial is a sign of disrespect for law enforcement, and they know it. :blackeye:
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Re: Maureen Peltier - SSG Moe - Militia Tool

Post by spiduh » Mon May 30, 2016 2:48 pm

aiiPancho wrote:
spiduh wrote:If you are going to misinterpret the Constitution, at least quote it right. It doesn't say 10 square miles, it say 10 miles square. That is 100 square miles. Dope.

There are an awful lot of overweight white folk in that bunch.
...and FB says they can see who's watching the stream. A sad looking bunch, regardless.
Huh. My understanding was that they can only see your name if you comment or follow them. But I could be wrong. The spouse works for a media company that does FB live streams often. I'll have to ask.
“If they kill me, grab my phone.” –Ammon Bundy (Reuters)
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Re: Maureen Peltier - SSG Moe - Militia Tool

Post by spiduh » Mon May 30, 2016 2:49 pm

RVInit wrote:Their first couple of 'monuments' to LaVoy were completely tasteless - a collection of red, white, and blue items, and 40 flags of every size. It looked like the leftovers you might find on July 5th at the dollar store.
Yes, but they are SACRED now.
“If they kill me, grab my phone.” –Ammon Bundy (Reuters)
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"I 'Self Identify' as a female" -Jon Ritzheimer (FB)

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Re: Maureen Peltier - SSG Moe - Militia Tool

Post by aiiPancho » Mon May 30, 2016 2:52 pm

spiduh wrote:
aiiPancho wrote:
spiduh wrote:
...and FB says they can see who's watching the stream. A sad looking bunch, regardless.
Huh. My understanding was that they can only see your name if you comment or follow them. But I could be wrong. The spouse works for a media company that does FB live streams often. I'll have to ask.
I wouldn't mind knowing, although that horse has now left the barn.

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Re: Maureen Peltier - SSG Moe - Militia Tool

Post by Flatpointhigh » Mon May 30, 2016 4:13 pm

mimi wrote:
spiduh wrote:
Volkonski wrote:Finicum's vehicle came to a stop about 100 yards north of the Joaquin Miller Horse Camp which is part of the Malheur National Forest. Google Maps shows that spot to be within the National Forest.
Oh, that's interesting. I'm fairly certain that the National Forest Service has a policy of removing all memorials.

ETA yup:
Memorials, Plaques, Honoraria or Commemorative Monuments on National Forest System lands
While the placement of a monument or memorial on public land may help some individuals through difficult times, these memorials are generally of significance to only those most closely tied to a specific person or event. Others may feel that memorials intrude on their experience of the Forest. For this and other reasons, the placement of monuments or memorials on National Forest System lands is prohibited.

In lieu of placing a monument or memorial on public land, the Forest Service asks that you consider honoring the person or event in ways that do not have a lasting impact on the landscape or other visitors’ experiences.
http://www.fs.usda.gov/malheur

I'm thinking a shrine at Bundy Ranch would be appropriate.

A shrine to all of those affected by following Bundy, whether by death or imprisonment.

A shrine of bad choices.
I like this concept.

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Re: Maureen Peltier - SSG Moe - Militia Tool

Post by Butterfly Bilderberg » Mon May 30, 2016 5:09 pm

So they're protesting across the street from the Federal court building which is closed for the Federal holiday? What is the goal here?
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Re: Maureen Peltier - SSG Moe - Militia Tool

Post by Whip » Mon May 30, 2016 5:17 pm

Butterfly Bilderberg wrote:So they're protesting across the street from the Federal court building which is closed for the Federal holiday? What is the goal here?
to be able to say they protested in front of a Federal building and no one had the balls to come out. :lol:

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Re: Maureen Peltier - SSG Moe - Militia Tool

Post by phelana » Mon May 30, 2016 8:16 pm

spiduh wrote:Somebody Lindsay Brewster Szymanski is livestreaming their Portland protest thingy.

Direct link:
And it's so interesting looking at their feet as they march. When, oh when, will they learn how to hold the camera properly...oh and your chitchat about the weather isn't interesting nor does it advance your cause. Neither does cursing at cars that are going down the street.
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Re: Maureen Peltier - SSG Moe - Militia Tool

Post by YellowMustard » Mon May 30, 2016 8:57 pm

phelana wrote: Neither does cursing at cars that are going down the street.
"I'll popsicle you with this flagpole!"

Classy.
----IANAL----

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Re: Maureen Peltier - SSG Moe - Militia Tool

Post by woodworker » Mon May 30, 2016 9:30 pm

I posted this earlier today to SSG Moe's page - I am now banned and posts deleted. Quelle surprise.

Ms. Peltier (I am submitting this post in multiple parts due to FB issues):

The defendants don’t need to worry about the jury becoming confused about water rights, land ownership, etc. because those issues will never come up in the trial. The charges that are facing the defendants don’t involve water rights, etc. – they primarily involve whether or not the defendants conspired to impede officers of the United States, possessed firearms in a federal facility, used and carried a firearm in relation to a crime of violence, theft of government property and depredation of government property (not all of the charges apply to all of the defendants).

The issues of whether Malheur is government property and whether the Federal government is supreme over the states are never going to be decided by the jury – it will be decided as a matter of law by the Court based on hundreds of cases of precedent. I refer you to the US Constitution, particularly Article VI, paragraph 2, which says

"This Constitution, and the laws of the United States which shall be made in pursuance thereof; and all treaties made, or which shall be made, under the authority of the United States, shall be the supreme law of the land; and the judges in every state shall be bound thereby, anything in the Constitution or laws of any State to the contrary notwithstanding." .

As I had previously responded to a post by Ms. Fiore, I had the following at hand re: Nevada (I believe that there are similar provisions for Oregon and all of the western states): Section 2 of the Nevada Constitution, which says, in relevant part:

But the Paramount Allegiance of every citizen is due to the Federal Government in the exercise of all its Constitutional powers as the same have been or may be defined by the Supreme Court of the United States; and no power exists in the people of this or any other State of the Federal Union to dissolve their connection therewith or perform any act tending to impair[,] subvert, or resist the Supreme Authority of the government of the United States. The Constitution of the United States confers full power on the Federal Government to maintain and Perpetuate its existance [existence], and whensoever any portion of the States, or people thereof attempt to secede from the Federal Union, or forcibly resist the Execution of its laws, the Federal Government may, by warrant of the Constitution, employ armed force in compelling obedience to its Authority.”

Ms. Peltier – Part II:
You might also want to look at the following legislation adopted by the Territory of Nevada and the People of Nevada (proposed and passed by the 1953 legislature; agreed to and passed by the 1955 legislature; approved and ratified by the people at the 1956 general election. See: Statutes of Nevada 1953, p. 718; Statutes of Nevada 1955, p. 926.], which states in relevant part, as follows:

“That the people inhabiting said territory do agree and declare, that they forever disclaim all right and title to the unappropriated public lands lying within said territory, and that the same shall be and remain at the sole and entire disposition of the United States; and that lands belonging to citizens of the United States, residing without the said state, shall never be taxed higher than the land belonging to the residents thereof; and that no taxes shall be imposed by said state on lands or property therein belonging to, or which may hereafter be purchased by, the United States, unless otherwise provided by the congress of the United States.”

So much for your argument that the Federal Government can’t own land in Nevada (and other states). You really should read the founding documents of this great country, the western states and the applicable case law before pretending to practice law. Of course, there is also more than 200 years of Supreme Court cases disagreeing with you, but then what does the Supreme Court know, despite the plain language of the Nevada Constitution saying that “the Paramount Allegiance of every citizen is due to the Federal Government in the exercise of all its Constitutional powers as the same have been or may be defined by the Supreme Court of the United States; and no power exists in the people of this or any other State of the Federal Union to dissolve their connection therewith or perform any act tending to impair[,] subvert, or resist the Supreme Authority of the government of the United States” or that “The Constitution of the United States confers full power on the Federal Government to maintain and Perpetuate its existance [existence], and whensoever any portion of the States, or people thereof attempt to secede from the Federal Union, or forcibly resist the Execution of its laws, the Federal Government may, by warrant of the Constitution, employ armed force in compelling obedience to its Authority.” I mean, it is only the Nevada Constitution, what do they know.

Lastly, there is nothing in the US Constitution about sheriffs, constitutional or otherwise. Again, citing to Nevada law, there is one, yes just one, reference in the Nevada Constitution to sheriff. It is in Article 4, Section 32 and it says that the “The Legislature shall have power to increase, diminish, consolidate or abolish the following county officers: County Clerks, County Recorders, Auditors, Sheriffs, District Attorneys and Public Administrators. The Legislature shall provide for their election by the people, and fix by law their duties and compensation. County Clerks shall be ex-officio Clerks of the Courts of Record and of the Boards of County Commissioners in and for their respective counties.” If the State Legislature can abolish the position of sheriff or if the State Legislature can say that the only duty the sheriff has is to clean out the stables, with no constitutional amendment required, it sure doesn’t seem like the sheriff is the most powerful guy around.



Ms. Peltier – Part III:
As to the issues being too complicated for the jury, juries have been able to handle complex cases with multiple defendants for years: organized crime cases, terrorism cases, securities fraud cases – juries are capable of figuring out who done what.

And as for all of these defendants being fine upstanding people who would never turn on each other – don’t bet the farm on that. I would estimate that by the time this goes to trial, at least 8-10 defendants will have plead out and end up testifying for the prosecution, mainly because there is so much evidence from all the stuff that the defendants posted on social media. And guess what folks, the prosecution doesn’t need a warrant to use what someone posts on Facebook.

And lastly, I would like to congratulate Ammon on hiring Morgan Philpot – with the Arnold Law Firm, Ammon had a semi-competent attorney. Now he has someone who has never tried a Federal criminal case and who has no clue about defending someone in criminal Federal court. My suggestion: stock up on popcorn.
Very truly yours, Howard Michael Appel (Cal. State Bar Number 158674). I am available and eager to discuss these issues at any time. All I ask is that you cite to actual sources that have been proven to be accurate (that lets out Kris Anne Hall) and that you allow me to respond. I agree and hope that any such discussion will be civil, with no name calling or ad hominem attacks. Although I agree to be civil and courteous, that does not mean however that I will not attack the merits of your positions or the credentials of any experts to whom you cite. For example, “Judge” Doucette is not a real judge, Kris Anne Hall is not a constitutional expert and there is no such thing as a “common law grand jury.” If you disagree with any of those three opinions, please cite to one, just one, case that Judge Doucette or Ms Hall have won arguing their theories of common law and constitutional law. Cite to one, just one, case upholding a common law grand jury. Hint: there are not any.

Looking forward to hearing from you, Howard Michael Appel (Ca. State Bar No. 158674).
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Re: Maureen Peltier - SSG Moe - Militia Tool

Post by Cato » Mon May 30, 2016 9:52 pm

That's a well written and substantive response. Well done.

It may seem to be a waste of time to respond in such a manner, but I for one appreciate it. Even stubborn people slowly let some information in, and neutral people may be swayed.

Kind of like trickle down economics. :liar:
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Re: Maureen Peltier - SSG Moe - Militia Tool

Post by YellowMustard » Mon May 30, 2016 11:22 pm

woodworker wrote:I posted this earlier today to SSG Moe's page - I am now banned and posts deleted. Quelle surprise.
That was well written, factual, and respectfully presented. That'll get you banned every time.

That is why I really hate these people. There is no talking to them. I enjoy a lively debate and would love to sit down and talk to an open minded "patriot" about this stuff, but it's simply impossible. I suspect that if I even reached out to them, they would dig up my address, where my daughter goes to school, where my family live and start sending death threats.

Banning, threatening, intimidating, etc. It's the only way they know to deal with things.
----IANAL----

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Re: Maureen Peltier - SSG Moe - Militia Tool

Post by RTH10260 » Mon May 30, 2016 11:32 pm

At MoeRon FB page there is now a claim that someone granted permission to place the rusting iron work*:
Screenshot_2016-05-31-05-22-31-1.png
PS. "patriots" are claiming that the police officer removed the metallic litter, while I have only seen reports him ordering the stuff removed. Who finally took the recycliing material?
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Re: Maureen Peltier - SSG Moe - Militia Tool

Post by Whatever4 » Mon May 30, 2016 11:58 pm

Indian land? And they gave permission? Uh.... No.
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Re: Maureen Peltier - SSG Moe - Militia Tool

Post by RVInit » Tue May 31, 2016 12:33 am

Whatever4 wrote:Indian land? And they gave permission? Uh.... No.
I love how good they are at building on lies. Private property...private Indian property with permission....private Indian property with permission and ODOT permission...
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Re: Maureen Peltier - SSG Moe - Militia Tool

Post by Burn'em Down » Tue May 31, 2016 12:39 am

RVInit wrote:
Whatever4 wrote:Indian land? And they gave permission? Uh.... No.
I love how good they are at building on lies. Private property...private Indian property with permission....private Indian property with permission and ODOT permission...

It's all one big game of "telephone". One person says something and by the time idiot #3 or so relays what they "heard" it magically fits the needs of their beliefs.

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Re: Maureen Peltier - SSG Moe - Militia Tool

Post by magdalen77 » Tue May 31, 2016 1:05 am

But of course one of the people whose sacred burial grounds you dug a shit trench through want to honor a fallen pooptriot.

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