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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 3:10 am 
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mighty dawg wrote:
Is it just me, or does it seem like Birthistan has really quieted down after the brief but spirited temper trantrum following Kemp's decision in Georgia?

Sounds like Swensson will be filing his appeal on Monday, but that promises to be a non-event.



Absolutely. The birfers went from shock, to outrage to paranoia. Obama "got to" the Judge. Obama "got to" Kemp. They both sold out to get perks from Obama.

Birfers always believe that the next big thing will work. The OGM moment is about to arrive. "This will show those nasty obots!"


For the birfers, the GA hearing was the Holy Grail of election challenges. And the birfers believed they found the Holy Grail.


OMG! Obama is going to be on TRIAL before a JUDGE! We will finally get our NBC ruling and Obama won't be on the ballot in GA. This will create BINDING PRECEDENT! Obama will be frogmarched out of the WH, arrested for treason and deported.


OMG! Judge Malihi DIDN'T DISMISS the challenge!


OMG! Orly SUBPOENAED the POTUS! He has to appear! If he doesn't, he will be arrested. Obama will have to sit in the witness stand and defend himself!


OMG! The motion to quash was DENIED and Malihi ORDERED Obama to appear at the TRIAL!


OMG! Orly is flying in expert witnesses!


OMG! Jablonski said he and his client were not going to appear at a circus! WHERE ARE THE MATCHING BRACELETS?!!


OMG! OBAMA DIDN'T SHOW! OBAMA DIDN'T SHOW! Obama's lawyer DIDN'T SHOW! DEFAULT IS OURS! The Judge gave us DEFAULT, Obama hasn't proven that he is a NBC, so he is an illegal alien and can be deported! DEPORTED!!! OBAMA IS GOING TO BE DEPORTED!


OMG! DEFAULT is announced here, there and everywhere. WE GOT DEFAULT!


OMG! Judge Malihi has RULED! scurry, scurry, scurry to Jack Ryan's scribd page.....


OMG! MALIHI IS A TRAITOR! HE IS A MUSLIM! OBAMA BOUGHT OFF MALIHI! THE ADMINISTRATION HAS CORRUPTED EVERY JUDGE IN THE COUNTRY! It's ok. Kemp knows that Malihi is wrong. It's ok.


omg! Kemp just ruled that Obama will be on the ballot! KEMP IS A TRAITOR! OBAMA BOUGHT OFF KEMP! THE ADMINISTRATION HAS BOUGHT THE SOS OF GA!


OMG! The lawyers are appealing! They are taking this to a REAL JUDGE in a REAL COURT!


Oh shit. Orly's appealing.




Grumble, grumble, grumble, grumble, grumble TRAITOR!



Prediction: In 2 more days ....

OOOOOOO! NEW SHINY OBJECT!

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 8:05 am 
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bob wrote:
Wagener on Taitz*:



* Ewwww.


Quote:
“Someone like this wouldn’t be allowed to pick tomatoes”


I’m surprised she didn’t say cotton. :roll:

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 9:28 am 
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LM K wrote:
Prediction: In 2 more days ....

OOOOOOO! NEW SHINY OBJECT!

Quite a few of them have already moved on to the March 1st report by Sheriff Joe's Cold Case Posse. While some are skeptical due to the whole Orly subpoena mishap, since this is the first investigation by law enforcement... :roll: ](*,)

While there are other ballot challenges going on, the birfer threads on them seem less than bubbling. It's almost that losing to an empty chair in Georgia soured them on this whole bright idea.

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 9:52 am 
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Yeah, it's been mighty quiet, Jim. Maybe too quiet. <-- OK, nobody watches cowboy movies any more.

If I hadn't been paying attention to these morons over the past three years, I might suspect that the hearing in Atlanta two weeks ago was some sorta high water mark for the birthers, and the toxic flooding could begin to recede from here on out.

But these are birthers. They're not going to accept re-election. They're going to ramp up the frenzy all the way to November and beyond (I hope).

The new Georgia cases will be filed this week. They have to accelerate all the hearings in those cases because the primary is March 6. Hatfield will take his as high as he can go as fast as he can go. Orly will be flappin' her yap, trying to get pro hack ceviche. Those will be entertaining cases, and will probably be hoppin' all during February.

Plus, as we've seen, new ones are poppin' up like dandelions. I don't expect to be bored any time soon. I'm enjoying the breather, myself.

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 10:00 am 
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One of my little pleasures in all of this is that Carl Swensson actually paid Hatfield & Hatfield for that pathetic performance where they lost to the Empty TableTM. That was just damn priceless. Now he is going to pay the dynamic duo even more for the appeal. =))

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And the wisdom to team up at Politijab The Fogbow with those who share my addiction and know the difference


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 10:30 am 
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Foggy wrote:
Yeah, it's been mighty quiet, Jim. Maybe too quiet. <-- OK, nobody watches cowboy movies any more.

If I hadn't been paying attention to these morons over the past three years, I might suspect that the hearing in Atlanta two weeks ago was some sorta high water mark for the birthers, and the toxic flooding could begin to recede from here on out.

But these are birthers. They're not going to accept re-election. They're going to ramp up the frenzy all the way to November and beyond (I hope).


I expect some form of Birferism to survive well past 2016. They will never accept Barack Obama's place in history.

After all, to this day you have moon landing deniers still actively trying to prove there were no moon landings.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 10:40 am 
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Reality Check wrote:
One of my little pleasures in all of this is that Carl Swensson actually paid Hatfield & Hatfield for that pathetic performance where they lost to the Empty TableTM. That was just damn priceless. Now he is going to pay the dynamic duo even more for the appeal. =))


I wanted so very badly for Jablonski to have co-counsel named McCoy. But, Hatfield losing to the empty chair was so much better. :lol:

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 12:22 pm 
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mimi wrote:
Reality Check wrote:
One of my little pleasures in all of this is that Carl Swensson actually paid Hatfield & Hatfield for that pathetic performance where they lost to the Empty TableTM. That was just damn priceless. Now he is going to pay the dynamic duo even more for the appeal. =))


I wanted so very badly for Jablonski to have co-counsel named McCoy. But, Hatfield losing to the empty chair was so much better. :lol:

Image

Link

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 1:48 pm 
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"After all, to this day you have moon landing deniers still actively trying to prove there were no moon landings."

Rumor has it that Barack Obama's original long form birth certificate can be found on the far side of the moon. My suggestion is that we send Orly there with a subpoena to pick it up. It would make her the first attorney/dentist/real estate agent to land on the moon. Definitely would be a milestone in the history of American space exploration. I can read the headlines now "Lunar Landing for Legal Lunatic."


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 2:58 pm 
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I was hoping Jablonski would bring in the services of this now unemployed legal expert:

http://hr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_McCoy

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 6:37 pm 
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Unnecessary. All Mr. Jablonski needed was an empty chair. Likewise on the appeal, where the AG will defend the SoS' decision.

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 7:18 pm 
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Quick question -- out of Obly's clients, which are residents, and which are candidates

Farrar -- resident
Lax -- candidate
Judy -- ??
Malaren -- ??
Roth ??

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 7:23 pm 
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Farrar is the only resident (and a joke). The rest are jokes who do not reside in Georgia. Candidates? Not so much.

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 7:32 pm 
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Roth was added by order http://www.scribd.com/doc/79682074/2012-01-07-FARRAR-Order-Granting-Extension-amp-Addition-of-Laurie-Roth

The other names first show up in the Obly's proposed order (draft) at http://www.scribd.com/doc/80169403/2012-02-01-FARRAR-Proposed-Findings-of-Fact-and-Conclusions-of-Law

Were there daffydavids?

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 7:33 pm 
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tjh wrote:
Quick question -- out of Obly's clients, which are residents, and which are candidates

Farrar -- resident
Lax -- candidate
Judy -- ??
Malaren -- ??
Roth ??


Cody lives in Utah.
MacLaren lives in Tennessee.
I think Laurie Roth is infesting Washington State

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 7:34 pm 
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Sterngard Friegen wrote:
The rest are jokes who do not reside in Georgia. Candidates? Not so much.

The rest think that if they have registered with the FEC, they are candidates. None are on the ballot, and I think only Roth even made an attempt to be included. (Taitz, in the ballot challenge, sought to have these "candidates" including, by, perhaps, magick and coquettishness.)

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 7:41 pm 
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It seems that her wiki page has been updated :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orly_Taitz#2012_Georgia_primary_challenge

Three groups filed challenges with the Secretary of State, Brian Kemp, regarding Obama's inclusion on the March primary ballot. Taitz represented Georgia resident (Farrar) and presidential candidates (Lax, Judy, Maclaren, and Roth).[67] Obama was represented by Michael Jablonski. Kemp referred the challenges to Deputy Chief Judge Michael Malihi, an administrative law judge, who denied Obama's motion to dismiss them and scheduled a hearing.[68]

On January 23, Malihi denied Jablonski's motion to quash a subpoena issued by Taitz to compel Obama to appear.[69] On January 25 Obama's attorney requested that the Secretary of State halt the proceedings, and indicated that Obama would no longer participate in the litigation.[70] Kemp denied their request and warned that it would be "at your own peril." [71]

Neither Obama nor Jablonski appeared at the January 26 hearings. Malihi offered the plaintiffs a default judgement, but they elected to "decide the case on the merits of their arguments and evidence." [72][73]

Taitz called eight witnesses (including herself), and presented seven exhibits, concerning Obama's Natural Born status, Citizenship, Names, Social Security Number and Hawaiian Birth Certificate. Taitz asked Malihi to find Obama in contempt for failing to appear.[74][75][76]

On February 3, Malihi recommended that Obama remain on the ballot. Concerning Taitz's case Malihi wrote: "The Court finds the testimony of the witnesses, as well as the exhibits tendered, to be of little, if any, probative value, and thus wholly insufficient to support plaintiffs’ allegations".[77][78] On February 6, Kemp accepted Malihi's recommendation.[79]

Drudge summarized : "Empty Table 1, Orly Taitz 0" [80]

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 8:15 pm 
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I would take issue with one part of the entry:

Quote:
Neither Obama nor Jablonski appeared at the January 26 hearings. Malihi offered the plaintiffs a default judgement, but they elected to "decide the case on the merits of their arguments and evidence." [72][73]


There is no evidence that Malihi offered a "default judgement" other than plaintiff's attorney's recollection of the in camera conference. Malihi used the term "default order" in the ruling. What that meant is the subject of much conjecture. It could mean anything from letting the plaintiffs submit there evidence in writing for the record in lieu of a hearing to actually ruling to recommend removal of Obama from the ballot. We do not know. Default judgement is clearly inaccurate.

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Grant me the superior wit and biting sarcasm to mock the Birthers whose minds I cannot change
The superior facts, law, and reason to change the minds of the Birthers whom I can
And the wisdom to team up at Politijab The Fogbow with those who share my addiction and know the difference


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 8:44 pm 
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Also, doesn't an ALJ make a recommendation, neither a "judgment" nor an "order?" (I note that ALJ Mahili used the term "order," but he might have been exceeding his authority, as I think he was wont to do.)

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 8:49 pm 
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Occupation: Amateur radio host trying to figure out how to lower myself to shameless begging and stupid petition filing. It might be a good way to make a living. ;)
You are correct my alter ego. ;)

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The O-bot prayer:

Grant me the superior wit and biting sarcasm to mock the Birthers whose minds I cannot change
The superior facts, law, and reason to change the minds of the Birthers whom I can
And the wisdom to team up at Politijab The Fogbow with those who share my addiction and know the difference


- Allison 2/16/2009


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 8:52 pm 
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mighty dawg wrote:
Rumor has it that Barack Obama's original long form birth certificate can be found on the far side of the moon. My suggestion is that we send Orly there with a subpoena to pick it up. It would make her the first attorney/dentist/real estate agent to land on the moon. Definitely would be a milestone in the history of American space exploration. I can read the headlines now "Lunar Landing for Legal Lunatic."


It was attached to a leg of the LM on the Apollo 13 mission. And as you know, that mission didn't land and the lander burned up on re-entry.

Tom Hanks told me that.

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 10:10 pm 
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TollandRCR wrote:
Also, doesn't an ALJ make a recommendation, neither a "judgment" nor an "order?" (I note that ALJ Mahili used the term "order," but he might have been exceeding his authority, as I think he was wont to do.)


The applicable rule describes it as a "default order," so that appears to be the proper term.

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 10:19 pm 
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A small quibble, but I also don't think it's correct to report that "[o]n January 25 Obama's attorney requested that the Secretary of State halt the proceedings, and indicated that Obama would no longer participate in the litigation.[70]"

As I recall, Jablonski said that he would not be participating pending the SoS's decision, and left open whether he would participate in the case of a denial of his request.

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 11:11 pm 
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Wiki : The phrasing is being changed. The "pending" and "order" are now in.

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2012 4:12 am 
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Dr. Blue wrote:
Nathanael wrote:
David needs to go brush up on his Bertrand Russell.


:-bd Ooooo.... I have always considered knowing about Russell to be pretty esoteric - mostly math or philosophy weenies - and I don't see him mentioned very much. Maybe I underestimate how widely he's known, but an excellent reference!!! :-bd


Well, I can't tell you how widely known Russell is, but I confess to being a bit of both -- math and philosophy weenie.

I happened to be reviewing a bit of Russell a couple weeks ago. He has an interesting discussion on epistemological scepticism in which he draws the distinction I outlined above between the logical inferences on which mathematical truths depend, and the analytical and inductive inferences we use to derive all our other knowledge.

The example Russell uses is of two friends looking out a window. As they turn away, one says, "There are houses outside." To which the other, the sceptic, replies, "How do you know they're still there?" The friend glances back and says, "I still see them."

The sceptic responds, "But how do you know they were there in the interim? How do you know looking didn't cause them?"

The response, Russell says, is that of course we have no way of knowing what the houses look like when no one's looking. If, that is, we insist we can only know things deductively or, as Kant would say, a priori. The problem with epistemoligical scepticism -- and the reason it's so hard to argue against -- is not that it is illogical, but that it is, in fact, inherently strictly logical. The real problem with epistemological scepticism is it's just plain silly.

History's most famous epistemological sceptic was, of course, DesCartes, who arrived through a strict application of deductive logic to his famous Cartesian axiom, "Cogito ergo sum." And Occam's Razor is simply history's best-known assertion of inductive reasoning. If you come to my house and find the doors locked, the lights off, and no one answering the bell, Occam doesn't rule out the strict possibility that I and my family are being held hostage in the bedroom by a crazed gunman. Inductive reasoning allows for the possibility that a conclusion may be in error. We simply reason from our experience to general principles based on what the most likely result is.

I had been pondering all that vis-a-vis conspiracy theories in general -- and birtherism specifically -- and had just decided that this fits conspiracy theories quite well. The eternal sceptical response to any piece of evidence offered that is not deductively derived is simply, "But how do we know that's true?" It looked an awfully like birthers' constantly shifting goalposts: COLB --> LFBC --> Vault copy --> ???.

And as I was cogitating on that, low and behold, Farrar, in the discussion several of us are having with him over at Squeeky Fromm's blog, made the statement I quoted above. It just didn't get any clearer than that. Farrar had already prepared his response to the vault copy, and it was "How do we know that's true?"

So there you have it, folks. Any conspiracy theory can be answered in one of two ways: either by Occam's razor and the argument from experience -- when have you ever seen an extraterrestrial, or a lifelike android? then the assertion that Obama is a robotic ET is just plain silly -- or by asking the sceptic how he ever gets across the street. After all, it's not impossible, deductively speaking, that a Mack truck suddenly appears out of nowhere the instant I look the other way.


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