Alabama US Senate: Special Election December 12, 2017

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Slim Cognito
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Re: Alabama US Senate: Special Election December 12, 2017

Post by Slim Cognito » Tue Nov 14, 2017 6:37 am

Some days, if it wasn't for twitter....
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neeneko
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Re: Alabama US Senate: Special Election December 12, 2017

Post by neeneko » Tue Nov 14, 2017 6:37 am

SLQ wrote:
Mon Nov 13, 2017 12:14 pm
I was a teen in the early 80s, in rural America (though not the rural south). There is no way my parents would have allowed me to date a man in his 30s. No. Freaking. Way. (They didn't even like the guy I was dating who was the same age I was, although in hindsight that was for good reason.)
I was a teen in the 90s, mid atlantic affluentish suburb. There, esp among the more out-crowd, teen girls dating older (anywhere between 20 and 50) men was sufficiently common that a running joke was that in a few decades one could start dating the types of girls they hung out with 'today'.

Annoyingly enough, the only time I can recall parents getting involved was a case where a teen girl was obsessed with a teacher, including showing up at his house drunk one night. He consistently rebuffed her but was fired for it anyway. So older men dating teen girls was fine, but rejecting them and causing a stir induced outrage.

We even had a couple of teachers dating students, and one who married her student as soon as he graduated.

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RoadScholar
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Re: Alabama US Senate: Special Election December 12, 2017

Post by RoadScholar » Tue Nov 14, 2017 6:42 am

Any male who gives up on getting sex voluntarily and resorts to blackmail, trickery, drugs, threats, or actual force may be a male but he can never be called a man.
The bitterest truth is healthier than the sweetest lie.

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Addie
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Re: Alabama US Senate: Special Election December 12, 2017

Post by Addie » Tue Nov 14, 2017 7:17 am

:like: :like: :like:
RoadScholar wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 6:42 am
Any male who gives up on getting sex voluntarily and resorts to blackmail, trickery, drugs, threats, or actual force may be a male but he can never be called a man.
¡Qué vergüenza!

stoppingby
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Re: Alabama US Senate: Special Election December 12, 2017

Post by stoppingby » Tue Nov 14, 2017 7:38 am

Chilidog wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 5:34 am
ZekeB wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 4:54 am
And if any of those men ran for political office and people knew what they did in the past, it would have cost them the election. The offices of Dog Catcher and Chief of Police excepted. I joined the Air Force in 1969 and the term "jail bait" was used to describe any girl under the age of 16.
That brings up an interesting point.

Moore was a graduate of West Point. He was an officer in Vietnam (a commander of an MP battalion).

No, he was not in combat, but since his own men tried to frag him, I suppose maybe he was a little PTSD.

He left the Army as soon as his five years service commitment was up and went to law school.

His time in the mall followed that.

There is something quite "off" about his history. I suspect that he was sexually immature and inexperienced.
I just had a horrible thought - do we know why his own men tried to frag him? It makes me wonder if they knew something about his behaviors with underaged vietnamese girls. If he was this bold in the U.S., it makes me wonder what he was doing while amongst a population that must have felt to be at mercy, at times, of the US military.

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Re: Alabama US Senate: Special Election December 12, 2017

Post by ZekeB » Tue Nov 14, 2017 7:51 am

I wouldn't go there (the girls thing) without proof. I have no idea of what age the average comfort girl was. As for the fragging thing, that might be a figment of his imagination. In what appeared to be a non-eventful tour in 'Nam, he may have said that to embellish the dangers he wanted others to think he was exposed to.
Vím o prasatech hodně zajímavých věcí.

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Chilidog
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Re: Alabama US Senate: Special Election December 12, 2017

Post by Chilidog » Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:10 am

stoppingby wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 7:38 am
Chilidog wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 5:34 am
ZekeB wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 4:54 am
And if any of those men ran for political office and people knew what they did in the past, it would have cost them the election. The offices of Dog Catcher and Chief of Police excepted. I joined the Air Force in 1969 and the term "jail bait" was used to describe any girl under the age of 16.
That brings up an interesting point.

Moore was a graduate of West Point. He was an officer in Vietnam (a commander of an MP battalion).

No, he was not in combat, but since his own men tried to frag him, I suppose maybe he was a little PTSD.

He left the Army as soon as his five years service commitment was up and went to law school.

His time in the mall followed that.

There is something quite "off" about his history. I suspect that he was sexually immature and inexperienced.
I just had a horrible thought - do we know why his own men tried to frag him? It makes me wonder if they knew something about his behaviors with underaged vietnamese girls. If he was this bold in the U.S., it makes me wonder what he was doing while amongst a population that must have felt to be at mercy, at times, of the US military.
From what I gather it was because he went around punishing soldiers for trivial infractions and being an overall asshole.

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Sugar Magnolia
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Re: Alabama US Senate: Special Election December 12, 2017

Post by Sugar Magnolia » Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:51 am

This is so good I can't even pick quotes from it.
Just go read it. It's not very long.
https://first-draft.com/2017/11/12/if-i ... daughters/

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Re: Alabama US Senate: Special Election December 12, 2017

Post by Tiredretiredlawyer » Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:57 am

Sugar Magnolia wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:51 am
This is so good I can't even pick quotes from it.
Just go read it. It's not very long.
https://first-draft.com/2017/11/12/if-i ... daughters/
Well done!
“I’ve been hooked since my first smell of C-4.” Linda Cox, first female Air Force Explosive Ordnance Disposal Technician, first to lead her own unit, go to war, be awarded a Bronze Star, and hold the highest enlisted rank of chief master sergeant.

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Addie
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Re: Alabama US Senate: Special Election December 12, 2017

Post by Addie » Tue Nov 14, 2017 9:09 am

NBC News
Amid Roy Moore Scandal, the Last Thing Alabama Democrats Want Is Help

WASHINGTON — Alabama Democrats have a message for out-of-state allies eager to help in the state's Senate race: Thanks, but no thanks.

"I tell them to stay home," said Giles Perkins, the former executive director of the Alabama Democratic Party. "This is an Alabama race, and we will decide it here."

Allegations of sexual impropriety against Republican Senate candidate Roy Moore may have created an opening for Democrats. But the scandal has also blown up Democrat Doug Jones' strategy of keeping the race under the radar in the overwhelmingly Republican state — and out of the national partisan fray.

"I’ve been nervous about this hoopla involving Roy Moore because of the danger of sucking out the issues — kitchen table issues — that Doug needs to focus on," said Bob Vance, a Democrat who came within striking distance of beating Moore in the 2012 race for chief justice of the Alabama Supreme Court.
¡Qué vergüenza!

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Tiredretiredlawyer
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Re: Alabama US Senate: Special Election December 12, 2017

Post by Tiredretiredlawyer » Tue Nov 14, 2017 9:25 am

“I’ve been hooked since my first smell of C-4.” Linda Cox, first female Air Force Explosive Ordnance Disposal Technician, first to lead her own unit, go to war, be awarded a Bronze Star, and hold the highest enlisted rank of chief master sergeant.

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AndyinPA
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Re: Alabama US Senate: Special Election December 12, 2017

Post by AndyinPA » Tue Nov 14, 2017 9:58 am

Sugar Magnolia wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:51 am
This is so good I can't even pick quotes from it.
Just go read it. It's not very long.
https://first-draft.com/2017/11/12/if-i ... daughters/
How incredibly sad. And true.

TexasFilly
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Re: Alabama US Senate: Special Election December 12, 2017

Post by TexasFilly » Tue Nov 14, 2017 10:28 am

I love the poorly educated!!!

I believe Anita Hill!

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Mikedunford
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Re: Alabama US Senate: Special Election December 12, 2017

Post by Mikedunford » Tue Nov 14, 2017 10:58 am

Sterngard Friegen wrote:
Fri Nov 10, 2017 7:26 pm
Kendra wrote:
Fri Nov 10, 2017 7:13 pm
http://thehill.com/homenews/media/35977 ... ew-and-far
Fox News legal analyst Mercedes Colwin said during a panel discussion on "Hannity" Thursday that women who experience sexual harassment and assault are "very few and far between."

Host Sean Hannity asked Colwin, a manager partner of the law firm Gordon & Rees in New York, how common it is for women to make up harassment allegations for money or "political reasons."

"There are individuals that'll come forward with these outrageous allegations," Colwin replied.

Hannity argued that those making allegations that are unfounded hurt the actual victims most.

"There are women who are victims of predators," Hannity said.

"There are, but very few and far between," Colwin replied.
Gordon & Rees is a big labor law firm which represents -- surprise -- companies and employers rather than employees. Colwin has never seen a case of sexual harassment or worse because she's paid not to.
Her firm seems to have had second thoughts about her comments.
https://abovethelaw.com/2017/11/biglaw- ... -her-firm/
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Azastan
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Re: Alabama US Senate: Special Election December 12, 2017

Post by Azastan » Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:19 am

Mikedunford wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 10:58 am

Her firm seems to have had second thoughts about her comments.
https://abovethelaw.com/2017/11/biglaw- ... -her-firm/
The partner in question has voluntarily stepped down from all management roles within the firm and she is committed to rectifying the hurtful impressions created by her remarks.
Indeed? Has anyone seen her on teevee yet apologizing for being wrong?

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Re: Alabama US Senate: Special Election December 12, 2017

Post by Gregg » Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:23 am

It seems to me like having one of your managing partners on record saying things like that isn't going to be good for the ongoing business os practicing employment law, its one thing to be identified as being a firm that represents employers accused of sexual harassment, but stories about your leaders saying its "few and far between" hits at your credibility.

Maybe I'm wrong on that.
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Re: Alabama US Senate: Special Election December 12, 2017

Post by AndyinPA » Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:28 am

Azastan wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:19 am
Mikedunford wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 10:58 am

Her firm seems to have had second thoughts about her comments.
https://abovethelaw.com/2017/11/biglaw- ... -her-firm/
The partner in question has voluntarily stepped down from all management roles within the firm and she is committed to rectifying the hurtful impressions created by her remarks.
Indeed? Has anyone seen her on teevee yet apologizing for being wrong?
...if they were offended.

:x

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Sterngard Friegen
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Re: Alabama US Senate: Special Election December 12, 2017

Post by Sterngard Friegen » Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:45 am

Is she still a Fox "News" commentator? If so, she's still trolling for business on the management side.

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Re: Alabama US Senate: Special Election December 12, 2017

Post by Patagoniagirl » Tue Nov 14, 2017 12:06 pm

Sugar Magnolia wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:51 am
This is so good I can't even pick quotes from it.
Just go read it. It's not very long.
https://first-draft.com/2017/11/12/if-i ... daughters/
Bingo.

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neeneko
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Re: Alabama US Senate: Special Election December 12, 2017

Post by neeneko » Tue Nov 14, 2017 12:17 pm

stoppingby wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 7:38 am
I just had a horrible thought - do we know why his own men tried to frag him? It makes me wonder if they knew something about his behaviors with underaged vietnamese girls. If he was this bold in the U.S., it makes me wonder what he was doing while amongst a population that must have felt to be at mercy, at times, of the US military.
I am skeptical about that kind of reason.

Years ago I knew a guy who served in vietnam who would tell stories about individuals or units that snapped and became violent, including a squad (not sure if that was the right unit size) successfully fragging their new C.O. The recurring theme was that the root always came down to putting their lives in danger. The propaganda was strong enough that the welfare of the locals was not enough on the radar to override the military loyalty stuff, and it was generally only coming home and going over memories that people started caring.

It generally takes a lot for deployed soldiers as a group to pick locals over one of their own.

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Re: Alabama US Senate: Special Election December 12, 2017

Post by NotaPerson » Tue Nov 14, 2017 1:17 pm

This may (or may not) help persuade some voters in Alabama...

Editorial in 3 Alabama newspapers blasts Moore as 'unfit for public office'

An editorial published by three of Alabama’s largest newspapers on Monday called Republican Senate candidate Roy Moore “grossly unfit for office” in the wake of allegations that he initiated sexual encounters with girls as young as 14 when he was in his 30s.

“Roy Moore simply cannot be a U.S. Senator. Even if his party and many of its adherents still think it possible, it is unthinkable — for his state, and his country,” wrote the AL.com editorial board, which feeds newspapers in Birmingham, Mobile and Huntsville.
https://www.politico.com/story/2017/11/ ... ama-244878
Am I being detained?

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Fortinbras
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Re: Alabama US Senate: Special Election December 12, 2017

Post by Fortinbras » Tue Nov 14, 2017 1:52 pm

I now wonder if anyone can use this information about Moore to challenge the validity of any of his judgments or vote to make a majority opinion while on the State Supreme Court.

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Re: Alabama US Senate: Special Election December 12, 2017

Post by Dan1100 » Tue Nov 14, 2017 1:57 pm

Fortinbras wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 1:52 pm
I now wonder if anyone can use this information about Moore to challenge the validity of any of his judgments or vote to make a majority opinion while on the State Supreme Court.
I am pretty sure the answer to that is "No."
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Re: Alabama US Senate: Special Election December 12, 2017

Post by AndyinPA » Tue Nov 14, 2017 2:09 pm

Dan1100 wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 1:57 pm
Fortinbras wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 1:52 pm
I now wonder if anyone can use this information about Moore to challenge the validity of any of his judgments or vote to make a majority opinion while on the State Supreme Court.
I am pretty sure the answer to that is "No."
I'm not an attorney, but I thought that in other cases that had been the true. I was wondering about that myself. I can't quote specific cases, but I thought there had been some instances where cases had been re-examined or thrown out because experts had been found to be biased. It seems to me something like this happened in Texas recently. And I seem to remember something about FBI agents being biased, too. I wouldn't begin to know how to search this, but it's just something I remember reading. Not too long ago, I read something about there being a lot of question about expert testimony and how reliable it is. I noticed that because my husband is a mechanical engineer and has testified as a forensic expert in court numerous times.

Of course, there has to be the will to go after this, I would guess.

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Sugar Magnolia
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Re: Alabama US Senate: Special Election December 12, 2017

Post by Sugar Magnolia » Tue Nov 14, 2017 2:30 pm

AndyinPA wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 2:09 pm
Dan1100 wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 1:57 pm
Fortinbras wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 1:52 pm
I now wonder if anyone can use this information about Moore to challenge the validity of any of his judgments or vote to make a majority opinion while on the State Supreme Court.
I am pretty sure the answer to that is "No."
I'm not an attorney, but I thought that in other cases that had been the true. I was wondering about that myself. I can't quote specific cases, but I thought there had been some instances where cases had been re-examined or thrown out because experts had been found to be biased. It seems to me something like this happened in Texas recently. And I seem to remember something about FBI agents being biased, too. I wouldn't begin to know how to search this, but it's just something I remember reading. Not too long ago, I read something about there being a lot of question about expert testimony and how reliable it is. I noticed that because my husband is a mechanical engineer and has testified as a forensic expert in court numerous times.

Of course, there has to be the will to go after this, I would guess.
I'd think expert witness testimony and a ruling by a judge would be two different things. One can be challenged, the other...not so much.

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