House Panel Holds AG Holder in Contempt

June bug · **Posted:** Tue Jul 03, 2012 8:32 pm

Don't you just love the (il)logic?

Dear Bar:

We think Eric's been a bad boy and we want you to investigate...not only that - we're telling you you have to!

Quote:

Further, it appears your own rules may remove any discretion and require an investigation. As per Rule XI, “Disciplinary Proceedings,” Section 10, “Disciplinary Proceedings Based Upon Conviction of Crime,” at http://www.dcbar.org/inside_the_bar/str ... rule11.cfm:

*snip*

While District of Columbia courts have not (yet) been involved, [and aren't going to be] there is no question that the Congress :?:

has found the Attorney General guilty of contempt under conditions that rise to your definition of “serious crime.” It would also appear that Attorney General Holder is required to report the contempt finding to you within the ten day requirement, and that the Bar “shall” investigate this matter.

You know, I don't believe House of Representatives can declare anyone "convicted" of a crime. Even in impeachment proceedings, they're limited to the equivalent of an indictment. It takes a super-majority in the Senate to convict.

In common, garden variety contempt of Congress charges, it takes a real, live court.

borealis · **Posted:** Tue Jul 03, 2012 9:23 pm

Don't laugh at this question. But does the AG have to be licensed in D.C.?

MaineSkeptic · **Joined:** Thu Mar 19, 2009 2:48 pm **Posts:** 5295

June bug wrote:

You know, I don't believe House of Representatives can declare anyone "convicted" of a crime.

Quote:

No Bill of Attainder ... shall be passed.

Edit: ooops

esseff44 · **Posted:** Tue Jul 03, 2012 9:49 pm

borealis wrote:

Don't laugh at this question. But does the AG have to be licensed in D.C.?

I find no record for Michael Mukasey or Alberto Gonzales. I did find membership records for Eric Holder (sinnce 1980) and the last 3-4 acting AG's.

I am not even sure the AG has to be a lawyer.

This site say not. The US Attorney is a different office as is the Solicitor General. The AG is more of an administrator and advisor to the president but does not represent the US in a legal action...AFAIK.

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Does_the_atto ... e_a_lawyer

Plutodog · **Posted:** Tue Jul 03, 2012 9:54 pm

esseff44 wrote:

borealis wrote:

Don't laugh at this question. But does the AG have to be licensed in D.C.?

I find no record for Michael Mukasey or Alberto Gonzales. I did find membership records for Eric Holder (sinnce 1980) and the last 3-4 acting AG's.

I am not even sure the AG has to be a lawyer.

This site say not. The US Attorney is a different office as is the Solicitor General. The AG is more of an administrator and advisor to the president but does not represent the US in a legal action...AFAIK.

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Does_the_atto ... e_a_lawyer

Or even a general! :lol:

verbalobe · **Posted:** Mon Jul 23, 2012 10:26 pm

So, Wayne La-PIERRRE, let me get this straight:

For three years we've heard nothing but "heads must roll! The feds allowed thousands of high-powered armaments into the possession of criminal cartels! This is reprehensible! Federal border agents DIED because these gangs were permitted to have these guns! Obama and Holder must be held accountable!"

But now... in an article with the unintentionally amusing headline "Disinformation Continues...", we read:

Quote:

This week, the [UN] delegates focused on an endless series of drafts that would either ban exportation or require states to consider the risk of exporting, if the arms could be used to commit crime, or could "be diverted to unauthorized end users" or "the illicit market." Exports could also be blocked if they would "support" or "encourage" terrorist acts or "provoke, prolong or aggravate acts of aggression or other breaches of the peace," or could be used in "gender-based violence" or to inflict "human suffering." Anti-gun activists here and abroad have long claimed that gun ownership in general does all of these things, so any of these provisions could be abused by foreign governments to shut off exports to law-abiding Americans.

Now, I'm not sure why the phrases "diverted to unauthorized end users" and "the illicit market" are in quotes -- as if such things do not actually exist, or are merely alleged to exist in the language of the treaty.

But perish the thought that "gun ownership" (such as that of the Mexican drug cartels?) should "breach the peace" or "inflict suffering"!

Methinks it is not just anti-gun activists that have been making this claim!

Methinks the NRA has a message problem.

bob · **Posted:** Sat Aug 18, 2012 4:09 pm

Quote:

Oversight Committee of Congress files a law suit against AG Holder for Contempt of Congress

Quote:

[NRA(!)]: House Committee Files Suit Against Holder

This week, the U.S. House of Representatives Committee on Oversight and Government Reform filed a civil lawsuit seeking to circumvent President Obama’s executive privilege claim and force the Department of Justice to hand over subpoenaed documents.

The filing is a follow-up to a June 28 resolution holding Attorney General Eric H. Holder, Jr. in contempt of Congress for failing to turn over subpoenaed documents about his department’s response to the disastrous “Fast and Furious” operation by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives. The resolution passed by a bipartisan vote of 255 to 67.

Obama administration officials and the Department of Justice had openly defied the committee’s legitimate requests for documents regarding one of the most deadly and disastrous fiascos in the history of American law enforcement, one which claimed the lives of Border Patrol agent Brian Terry and I.C.E. agent Jaime Zapata. And in a historically unprecedented maneuver, President Obama claimed executive privilege to justify withholding Justice Department deliberations from a congressional subpoena.

http://www.orlytaitzesq.com/?p=246245 :twisted:

Quote:

The judge on the case of the Oversight committee of Congress v Holder is an Obama appointee

Amy Berman Jackson[*]

http://www.orlytaitzesq.com/?p=246317 :twisted:

* Don't tell Stern, but she has two degrees from Hah-vard.

A Legal Lohengrin · **Joined:** Tue Oct 26, 2010 9:56 pm **Posts:** 9710

bob wrote:

Quote:

Oversight Committee of Congress files a law suit against AG Holder for Contempt of Congress

And in a historically unprecedented maneuver, President Obama claimed executive privilege to justify withholding Justice Department deliberations from a congressional subpoena.

Utter nonsense. In fact, the sentence tacitly admits that it is nonsense, because it describes the material withheld as "deliberations." That would put it solidly under what has been called, since time immemorial, the deliberative process privilege.

SueDB · **Posted:** Sat Aug 18, 2012 5:40 pm

A Legal Lohengrin wrote:

bob wrote:

Quote:

Oversight Committee of Congress files a law suit against AG Holder for Contempt of Congress

And in a historically unprecedented maneuver, President Obama claimed executive privilege to justify withholding Justice Department deliberations from a congressional subpoena.

Utter nonsense. In fact, the sentence tacitly admits that it is nonsense, because it describes the material withheld as "deliberations." That would put it solidly under what has been called, since time immemorial, the deliberative process privilege.

Congress should get on the AG's ass. He needs the cash and folks to pursue these sons of bitches. :((

Emma · **Joined:** Tue Aug 04, 2009 2:25 am **Posts:** 2921

Quote:

There is no evidence that Attorney General Eric Holder and high-ranking officials at the Justice Department knew that guns were allowed to “walk” during an ATF operation known as Fast and Furious, according to a report released on Wednesday afternoon by the department’s internal watchdog.

Following a 19-month investigation, the Inspector General found that the decision not to take action against low-level “straw purchasers” was made by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) and the Arizona U.S. Attorney’s office. Their decision, according to the report, “was primarily the result of tactical and strategic decisions by the agents and prosecutors, rather than because of any legal limitation on their ability to do so.” Dennis Burke, the head of the U.S. Attorney’s office at the time, resigned from his position in August 2011.

The IG report is considered to be the most comprehensive and least partisan account of the scandal available to date. Unlike investigators with Rep. Darrell Issa’s House Oversight Committee, DOJ investigators had access to criminal investigation files.

http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.c ... report.php

MaineSkeptic · **Joined:** Thu Mar 19, 2009 2:48 pm **Posts:** 5295

Emma wrote:

The IG report is considered to be the most comprehensive and least partisan account ...

According to a CNN Breaking News email:

Quote:

Fourteen employees of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives and the U.S. Justice Department face disciplinary action for their roles in the botched Fast and Furious weapons-tracking program, according to a report released today by department investigators.

No criminal charges are recommended, according to the report.

realist · **Joined:** Fri Jan 23, 2009 1:33 pm **Posts:** 23944

Supplement to Skeppy's post above...

Quote:

National News Alert

Watchdog faults Justice Department over Fast and Furious; no evidence Holder was informed

The Justice Department's internal watchdog is faulting the agency for misguided strategies, errors in judgment and management failures during a bungled gun-trafficking probe in Arizona that resulted in hundreds of weapons turning up at crime scenes in the United States and Mexico.

In a 471-page report, Inspector General Michael Horowitz referred over a dozen people for possible disciplinary action for their roles in Operation Fast and Furious. The report did not criticize Attorney General Eric Holder.

The report found no evidence that Holder was informed about the operation before Jan. 31, 2011, or that the attorney general was told about the controversial gun-walking tactic employed by the department's Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.

Read more at:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/ ... story.html

Army Girl · **Joined:** Thu Jun 02, 2011 11:33 am **Posts:** 83

Apparently time-travel is now possible.

According to Fox News:

"The report also reveals the botched operation may have played a role in a 2009 massacre, where 18 young men were killed at a rehabilitation center also in Juarez. The massacre was reportedly ordered and carried out by Mexican hit men."

The rehab center shooting occurred in September 2009, a full month before the operation began. But they couldn't be bothered to check into that little detail, could they?

Chilidog · **Joined:** Mon Jan 09, 2012 12:36 pm **Posts:** 2000

linky?

Falsehoods unchallenged only fester and grow.

House Panel Holds AG Holder in Contempt

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