Fischer v. Cruz (E.D.N.Y.)

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bob
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Fischer v. Cruz (E.D.N.Y.)

Postby bob » Mon Mar 14, 2016 11:10 pm

Riverhead Local: Calverton man files federal lawsuit challenging Ted Cruz’s Constitutional eligibility to run for president:
Calverton resident Greg Fischer is taking on Republican presidential candidate Ted Cruz.

Fischer has filed an action in federal district court seeking a ruling that Ted Cruz is not a “natural born citizen” within the meaning of Article II of the United States Constitution.

The action, filed in Central Islip on Friday, looks to boot Cruz, who was born in Canada, off the ballot in New York. The suit names Cruz and the state board of elections as defendants.

* * *

“Ted was her anchor baby,” Fischer said in an interview today, arguing that the candidate’s mother “constructively abandoned” her U.S. citizenship when she started voting in Canada.

“There is only one birthright that natural born citizens have that naturalized citizens don’t,” he said, “and that’s running for president of the United States. I’m the lone defender in all of New York of that right.”

* * *

Fischer said the only other federal lawsuits now pending on the topic of Cruz’s right to run for president are in federal courts in Alabama and Texas. A suit brought against the New York board of elections in state court in New York City was dismissed because it wasn’t brought in federal court and it didn’t name Cruz as a defendant, Fischer argues.

* * *

Fischer, in a memorandum of law supporting his complaint, quotes two U.S. Supreme Court decisions with contrary holdings.

The 1898 case of U.S. v. Wong Kim Ark, the high court said, according to Fischer’s memorandum, “The notion that there is any common-law principle to naturalize the children born in foreign countries, of native-born American father ‘and’ mother, father ‘or’ mother, must be discarded. There is not, and never was, any such common-law principle.”

He also quotes the 1971 U.S. Supreme Court decision in Rogers v. Bellei: “Not until 1934 would that person [a child born to a U.S. citizen outside the United States] have had any conceivable claim to United States citizenship. For more than a century and a half no statute was of assistance. Maternal citizenship afforded no benefit.”

* * *

“This is a huge case,” Fischer said. “This is for real.”

Fischer, a Democrat who has run unsuccessfully for several elective offices over the years — most recently for Riverhead Town assessor and Riverhead school board in 2015 — has announced his candidacy for N.Y. State Senate. He plans to challenge longtime incumbent Republican incumbent Sen. Ken LaValle, he said.

Ob.: No standing.


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Notorial Dissent
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Re: Fischer v. Cruz (E.D.N.Y.)

Postby Notorial Dissent » Tue Mar 15, 2016 1:13 am

I agree, that they will most probably bounce this on standing, since none of them so far certainly have any, but I would like to see how they are going about it and what legal justifications they are using.


The fact that you sincerely and wholeheartedly believe that the “Law of Gravity” is unconstitutional and a violation of your sovereign rights, does not absolve you of adherence to it.

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Re: Fischer v. Cruz (E.D.N.Y.)

Postby bob » Tue Mar 15, 2016 1:36 am

Notorial Dissent wrote:I agree, that they will most probably bounce this on standing, since none of them so far certainly have any, but I would like to see how they are going about it and what legal justifications they are using.

With Obama, the federal courts made it clear your average citizen voter lacks standing. See Berg (3d Cir.); Keyes|Barnett|Drake (9th Cir.).

The federal suit in Arkansas against Cruz was similarly dismissed. The dismissal in this suit will too (also) be similar.


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Notorial Dissent
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Re: Fischer v. Cruz (E.D.N.Y.)

Postby Notorial Dissent » Tue Mar 15, 2016 4:37 am

bob wrote:
Notorial Dissent wrote:I agree, that they will most probably bounce this on standing, since none of them so far certainly have any, but I would like to see how they are going about it and what legal justifications they are using.

With Obama, the federal courts made it clear your average citizen voter lacks standing. See Berg (3d Cir.); Keyes|Barnett|Drake (9th Cir.).

The federal suit in Arkansas against Cruz was similarly dismissed. The dismissal in this suit will too (also) be similar.

And yet, it still seems to be a lesson unlearned.


The fact that you sincerely and wholeheartedly believe that the “Law of Gravity” is unconstitutional and a violation of your sovereign rights, does not absolve you of adherence to it.

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Re: Fischer v. Cruz (E.D.N.Y.)

Postby bob » Tue Mar 15, 2016 11:41 am

On the one hand, many of these new challengers aren't birthers, so they aren't familiar with the past litigation.

On the other hand, many of these new challengers aren't birthers, so they should be smart enough to do some basic research.


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Re: Fischer v. Cruz (E.D.N.Y.)

Postby Volkonski » Tue Mar 15, 2016 11:48 am

bob wrote:Riverhead Local: Calverton man files federal lawsuit challenging Ted Cruz’s Constitutional eligibility to run for president:
Calverton resident Greg Fischer is taking on Republican presidential candidate Ted Cruz.

:snippity:

Fischer, a Democrat who has run unsuccessfully for several elective offices over the years — most recently for Riverhead Town assessor and Riverhead school board in 2015 — has announced his candidacy for N.Y. State Senate. He plans to challenge longtime incumbent Republican incumbent Sen. Ken LaValle, he said.

Ob.: No standing.


Riverhead! :swoon: That's our LI town. :? There are birthers in Riverhead. :shock:

At least he is from Calverton (on the western side of town) and not the North Fork. ;)


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Re: Fischer v. Cruz (E.D.N.Y.)

Postby bob » Tue Mar 15, 2016 1:09 pm

This isn't Fischer's first rodeo: Newsday (in Feb.): Ted Cruz’s ballot status challenged by Suffolk gadfly:
A Suffolk Democratic civic gadfly has filed objections to derail Ted Cruz’s presidential candidacy in New York because he was born in Canada.

Gregory John Fischer of Calverton hand-delivered letters to the Suffolk Board of Elections in Yaphank filing general objections to the Cruz’s petitions for the April 19 state GOP presidential primary, as well as to Cruz’s delegate slate.

There's more, but it is behind a subscription wall.


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Re: Fischer v. Cruz (E.D.N.Y.)

Postby bob » Tue Mar 15, 2016 1:13 pm

Also: Suffolk Times: Ted Cruz ballot eligibility challenged in federal court by Calverton man:
Mr. Fischer has unsuccessfully sought local office several times, aiming for town supervisor and New York State Comptroller seats, among others. He most recently finished third in a three-person race for assessor.

Mr. Fischer has tasted some success in the past in getting a candidate’s name removed from a ballot. In 2010, state Sen. Ken KaValle’s campaign successfully challenged the residency of Regina Calcaterra, a Democrat who was going to face him in the general election. State courts eventually ruled her ineligible to run. Mr. Fischer, who has sought the Democratic nomination to oppose Mr. LaValle in the past, was the first to bring the issue to light.


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Re: Fischer v. Cruz (E.D.N.Y.)

Postby GregFischer » Sun Mar 27, 2016 9:09 pm

What about my standing as a down-ballot candidate?

Greg Fischer
Candidate for NYS Senate District 1 --- Eastern Long Island
P.O Box 285
Calverton, New York 11933-0285
perfect100@hotmail.com
https://www.facebook.com/gregfischerUS
Office & Messages: 631-727-9637



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Re: Fischer v. Cruz (E.D.N.Y.)

Postby spiduh » Sun Mar 27, 2016 10:52 pm

GregFischer wrote:What about my standing as a down-ballot candidate?

Greg Fischer
Candidate for NYS Senate District 1 --- Eastern Long Island
P.O Box 285
Calverton, New York 11933-0285
perfect100@hotmail.com
https://www.facebook.com/gregfischerUS
Office & Messages: 631-727-9637

Fischer said he has standing to force Cruz from the ballot although he is a Democrat. “I think I have standing because I can vote in the general election and I’m a registered voter,” he said.

I think you are going to get bounced on standing on either of those arguments Mr. Fischer, but IANAL. If you don't somehow you should spend a little time in the Cruz eligibility thread here because there are some VERY persuasive arguments there made regarding Cruz's ineligibility complete with citations.


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Re: Fischer v. Cruz (E.D.N.Y.)

Postby Sterngard Friegen » Sun Mar 27, 2016 11:11 pm

GregFischer wrote:What about my standing as a down-ballot candidate?

Greg Fischer
Candidate for NYS Senate District 1 --- Eastern Long Island
P.O Box 285
Calverton, New York 11933-0285
perfect100@hotmail.com
https://www.facebook.com/gregfischerUS
Office & Messages: 631-727-9637

:nope:


The Sternsig rule: When there are a finite number of ways to screw something up, Orly Taitz will find an infinite number of ways to do it.

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Re: Fischer v. Cruz (E.D.N.Y.)

Postby bob » Mon Mar 28, 2016 12:15 am

GregFischer wrote:What about my standing as a down-ballot candidate?

Down-ballot candidacy won't save a generalized grievance.

And welcome to the Fogbow.


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Notorial Dissent
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Re: Fischer v. Cruz (E.D.N.Y.)

Postby Notorial Dissent » Mon Mar 28, 2016 1:15 am

Not to mention different race and party, and you only have generalized gripe, no actual harm, will not get you standing or in the door.


The fact that you sincerely and wholeheartedly believe that the “Law of Gravity” is unconstitutional and a violation of your sovereign rights, does not absolve you of adherence to it.

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Re: Fischer v. Cruz (E.D.N.Y.)

Postby Orlylicious » Mon Mar 28, 2016 2:55 am

Welcome to the Fogbow, it's an amazing place. Best shots would be a Secretary of State removes Cruz from the ballot so he'd have to sue to be reinstated (have you gotten your info to them?), or a Republican presidential candidate can claim that the ineligible candidate damaged the candidate by disenfranchising voters. There are many choose from in this field that Charles Krauthammer called the best candidates in 35 years. Maybe Pataki :P
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Re: Fischer v. Cruz (E.D.N.Y.)

Postby Adrianinflorida » Mon Mar 28, 2016 4:12 am

Somebody, other than Orly, has been googling their own name......welcome, Mr Fischer.



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Re: Fischer v. Cruz (E.D.N.Y.)

Postby Sam the Centipede » Mon Mar 28, 2016 4:36 am

Welcome Mr. Fischer. Without being a lawyer, I can tell you that your frivolous suit is doomed to the same failure that all similar such suits against the President enjoyed. The question is only about which grounds the court will choose for dismissal. But dismiss it will.

Even if you were a genuine Republican genuinely running, your suit would fail. I wonder if the lawyers here might enlighten us as to whether there is an additional legal principle (preferably with a Latin label!) saying "you only faked your position to try to manufacture a controversy therefore get out of my courtroom"?



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Re: Fischer v. Cruz (E.D.N.Y.)

Postby Mikedunford » Mon Mar 28, 2016 6:08 am

Sterngard Friegen wrote:
GregFischer wrote:What about my standing as a down-ballot candidate?

Greg Fischer
Candidate for NYS Senate District 1 --- Eastern Long Island
P.O Box 285
Calverton, New York 11933-0285
perfect100@hotmail.com
https://www.facebook.com/gregfischerUS
Office & Messages: 631-727-9637

:nope:


:yeah:



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Re: Fischer v. Cruz (E.D.N.Y.)

Postby bob » Thu Apr 07, 2016 5:35 pm

Surprise, surprise, surprise!: dismissed; no standing. Hollander and Drake (and the federal suits against Cruz) cited.


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Re: Fischer v. Cruz (E.D.N.Y.)

Postby TexasFilly » Thu Apr 07, 2016 11:32 pm

What happened to Mr. Fischer? Is he going to come back and tell us about the appeal?


I love the poorly educated!!!

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Re: Fischer v. Cruz (E.D.N.Y.)

Postby GregFischer » Sat Apr 09, 2016 1:28 am

I am looking for a way to trump standing --- attorney (or judicial) affirmative obligations perhaps?

The Attorney General (why appeared as a Cruz attorney de facto) having an affirmative obligation perhaps?

Backhanded admission of the merits --- Cruz never answered and never a denial of the merits perhaps?

Ideas?



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Re: Fischer v. Cruz (E.D.N.Y.)

Postby GregFischer » Sat Apr 09, 2016 1:29 am

TexasFilly wrote:What happened to Mr. Fischer? Is he going to come back and tell us about the appeal?


I'm here --- have any thought on how to edge in?



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Re: Fischer v. Cruz (E.D.N.Y.)

Postby bob » Sat Apr 09, 2016 1:45 am

GregFischer wrote:
TexasFilly wrote:What happened to Mr. Fischer? Is he going to come back and tell us about the appeal?

I'm here --- have any thought on how to edge in?

Become a write-in candidate for the Republican primary. And even that is unlikely to work.


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Re: Fischer v. Cruz (E.D.N.Y.)

Postby Notorial Dissent » Sat Apr 09, 2016 2:09 am

GregFischer wrote:I am looking for a way to trump standing --- attorney (or judicial) affirmative obligations perhaps?

The Attorney General (why appeared as a Cruz attorney de facto) having an affirmative obligation perhaps?

Backhanded admission of the merits --- Cruz never answered and never a denial of the merits perhaps?

Ideas?

Why don't you work on a way of trumping the law of gravity while you're at it? You have about equal possibility of success. In other words, NONE. Bob was being nice, I don't feel like it this evening.

The AG was appearing to defend the State and the State's process, that is his job, it wouldn't have mattered who you were complaining about.

You have no real/particularized damage, and hurt fee fees don't count. You have no more or less(well way less really) possibility of winning than anyone else who is running, so no standing, you have no cause of action since you have NO standing and NO damage, and No law to support you while we're at it, so no basis for challenge. By the way, the whole write-in challenge thingy, been done and FAILED. You might want to ask CRJ how that worked for him.


The fact that you sincerely and wholeheartedly believe that the “Law of Gravity” is unconstitutional and a violation of your sovereign rights, does not absolve you of adherence to it.

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Re: Fischer v. Cruz (E.D.N.Y.)

Postby Sam the Centipede » Sat Apr 09, 2016 6:41 am

GregFischer wrote:
TexasFilly wrote:What happened to Mr. Fischer? Is he going to come back and tell us about the appeal?


I'm here --- have any thought on how to edge in?

IANAL(BIRTFB) so I can be confident of three things: firstly, that courts exist to resolve actual controversies which fall properly under their jurisdiction, secondly, courts do not appreciate being used as tools of harassment by people pursuing frivolous vendettas, and thirdly, that they can see through any stunts you pull to try to look relevant.

The lawyers on the Fogbow tend to be an ethical lot so they don't often hand out legal advice to possible parties in cases. They comment on third party cases as members of the public but they are careful to avoid gaining an unethical attorney-client relationship with a forum member. So you probably won't get much free advice from them!

Your case is frivolous. Surely you know that as well as anybody?

You are trying to use the court system to cause Ted Cruz's campaign problems. That is NOT a proper use of the legal system. That is childish and immoral. Stop it.

If you don't want Ted Cruz as a presidential candidate or as president, do you know what you should do? Vote. Vote for someone else. That is how democracy works. By voting. By taking part in the political process.

Not by juvenile attempts to game the court system. Grow up. Go out campaigning. Use your vote.



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Re: Fischer v. Cruz (E.D.N.Y.)

Postby GregFischer » Sat Apr 09, 2016 10:20 am

"Sam the Centipede", et al --- harassment, partisanship, and any form of "playing" is not what I am doing. Sorry, but you are missing my point.

1.) Lets start with this:

https://fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/R42097.pdf
Oddly, it was revised in 2016, but the more recent seems to have been pulled down by CRS; it still can be found here:
http://armsandthelaw.com/CRS%20on%20natural%20born.pdf (and the later includes: "This report has been updated from a previous version to include recent relevant judicial and administrative decisions, and will be updated as new decisional material may warrant.")

2.) Then, how do we get there (to truth, and somewhere further away from fraud and waste) from here (the land of WTH)?

Regards,
Greg


Notes to (1.):
(A.) https://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/RL33079.pdf --- Birthright citizenship
(B.) https://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/R44251.pdf --- Birthright citizenship




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